Hitsugaya Toushiro vs. Zaraki Kenpachi

[IppoSama]

ahh now that i think about it, thats true it was never a 2v1 fight at full power

[Whimsy]

I never referred to Kenpachi as a "god", and I am fully aware that he never beat 2 captains at full power, hence I never stated that he had, just that he took 2 of their shikai's at once without taking any significant damage.

His loss to Ichigo was PIS and CIS, as should have been made clear when compared to his 2 later fights. As both of those are out in battle threads unless stated, Kenpachi will go for the kill. Alas, Toshiro doesn't really suffer from those. In fact he benefited from Luppi's CIS, since due to Luppi's monumental arrogance he wasn't promptly butchered after being shot down.

Fact is in a straight battle with no prep-time Luppi>Hitsugaya. Kenpachi beat someone higher ranked and who didn't reek of fail.

I see no way in which Hitsugaya can survive a kendo strike, and unless he's given a lot of preptime it's doubtful he could produce an attack to put Kenpachi down.

Edit: Oh sorry, looks like you weren't referring to me

[Big Green]

No, they used shikai. Tousen did his thing where he shot a bunch of blades out of the sky, and Komomura made one of the giant's arms attack Kenpachi. When the dust cleared, he was standing there laughing. Like always.
Kenpachi easily overpowers Hitsugaya physically. Two or three good shots and Toushiro's down. It's like putting a bear against a guy with a snow cone.

Ain't see you around, Whimsy. And I think he was referring to you.

[IppoSama]

Originally Posted by Whimsy

I never referred to Kenpachi as a "god", and I am fully aware that he never beat 2 captains at full power, hence I never stated that he had, just that he took 2 of their shikai's at once without taking any significant damage.

His loss to Ichigo was PIS and CIS, as should have been made clear when compared to his 2 later fights. As both of those are out in battle threads unless stated, Kenpachi will go for the kill. Alas, Toshiro doesn't really suffer from those. In fact he benefited from Luppi's CIS, since due to Luppi's monumental arrogance he wasn't promptly butchered after being shot down.

Fact is in a straight battle with no prep-time Luppi>Hitsugaya. Kenpachi beat someone higher ranked and who didn't reek of fail.

I see no way in which Hitsugaya can survive a kendo strike, and unless he's given a lot of preptime it's doubtful he could produce an attack to put Kenpachi down.

Edit: Oh sorry, looks like you weren't referring to me

heh yeah my retort wasnt at you, mostly at sol . I dont know if ken could hit hitsu with a kendo strike , why you ask? Nnotria or however you spell his name was all about "ooo look at how hard my skin is you cant pierce it come on try ,i dont care if you hit me" That was his downfall from the start , that and he basically fought a better version of himself (someone who relies on strength and durability). If the fight went down i dont think hitsu would be doing the same thing . But regardless the odds are stacked in Kens favor especially after seeing the power up he did from SS to this arc. Basically alot of ppl underestimate Hitsu because hes been the captain with the most exposure and ppl are sick of seeing him (again not you but just looking at any thread with him in it folks dislike him). Either way its a good fight and whoever wins would be tore up

[SHADENINJA]

Yes, Kenpachi never beat 2 captains at once

He first beat the tar out of the idiot Fox Captain, who then left the battle to a fresh Captain (Tousen) who used his shikai twice, failed to injure Kenpachi seriously at all (meanwhile Kenpachi was allowing himself to be hit) then used BanKai, and after catching Tousen's sword and LETTING TOUSEN GO, neglected to finish the match because Tousen left

In other words

he fought one captain, who fled

then fought another captain, allowed himself to be hit several times, then pwned the Captain's BanKai, LET HIM GO, and then was unable to continue the match because Tousen went away


you're right though. that's not impressive at all

[Ycagel]

What...? I just read the battle again and...That's not how it happened at all.

Fox guy initiated the battle by using his Shikai, which created a lot of smoke when striking down. Tousen then used his second Shikai and shot it into the smoke. When the smoke settled, it was revealed the Kenpachi blocked/evaded Komamura's Shikai and was hit by four of Tousen's blades.

After he ripped them out, both Tousen and Komamura attacked him with their normal swords, and he blocked with his. While they were pushing him down with their blades, Tousen left himself open and was kicked away for that mistake, which made Komamura turn his focus away from Kenpachi and onto Tousen. Kenpachi then grabbed and slammed fox-guy down into the ground while he was distracted. After that, Tousen used his Bankai.

Tousen then lost cuz he was an idiot and Kenpachi was a beast...

[Righteous Judgment]

Originally Posted by Whimsy

Hitsugaya gets shish-kebabbed. Think about it, patched Kenpachi one-shotted a guy who is arguably stronger than the person who butt-fucked limited Hitsugaya in the arrancar invasion arc.

Also, if Luppi survived an attack that took Hitsugaya all the prep-time in the world to produce, Kenpachi certaintly isn't going down. That same Luppi was later ceroed out of existence, whereas Kenpachi swats ceroes.

Also there's 2 captains at once feat for Ken-chan. Eyepatch may not even need to be removed.

Like I said before ken didn't get hit by it he consciously and purpously avoided it whereas say noitora can be hit with one or two and take no visable damage. dont think its as cut and dry as you think but we should all know if kubo ever wrote out such a battle ken would win.

[IppoSama]

never said kenpachi wasnt impressive but lets be REAL ... if tousen wanted to finish kenpachi in just ONE blow ala cutting him in half or another cut of sort he could of ... He didnt because he had to go on a stupid rant about justice and fear of the dark etc etc. If tousen was like "BANKAI" then a true killing blow ken would of lost . Besides that the fox captain didnt do much in the fight. All im trying to say is , it wouldnt be as rape as everyone thinks. I like both captains ALOT just annoyed that lots think its this one sided massacre

[KillMe]

he did not avoid either tousens or komamoru's attacks they clear stated he got hit by both - they simply weren't enough to injure kenpachi seriously - kenpachi had no moved a step

kenpachi then easy held off both captains attacks with 1 hand with his eyepatch firmly in place - then beat the crap out of the two of them

tousen then went bankai and kenpachi was so fast that a CAPTAIN couldn't land a fatal wound when the first warning kenpachi got of said attack was it hitting his skin

kenpachi then let himself take a wound to a vital spot - laughed it off and choped tousen pratically in half - then let him go - rinse and repeat - tousens bankai goes bye bye ( sign that your on verge of death - then trys to stab kepnachi in teh back - cant muster enough to even break his skin this time

komamoru jumps in to save tousen - and goes bankai - they fight for afew minutes ( time taken for the release of soukyouku thing to yamatas release against ukitake and shunsui - in that time he reciveves no injuries and still had his eye patch on and fighting with 1 hand

hitsugaya barely beats an non espada arrancar - against luppi who was #6 to replace grimmy though clearly alto weaker than grimmy considering grimmy insta owned him - hitsu was loosing badly and even with long long long prep time his biggest attack failed to kill luppi

so hitsugaya < luppi < grimmy < noitora < kenpachi

kenpachi would asswhoop hitsugaya to heuco mundo and back - not two ways to look at it - kenpachi is well out of hitsugaya's lead

hitsu is good captain and strong aswell but in terms of fighting potential he cant match upto ken - very few of the captains can

simply put kenpachi is a beast

[IppoSama]

Bleach 146 page 13 | One Manga
Bleach 146 page 14 | One Manga
Bleach 146 page 15 | One Manga

im sorry to burst your kenpachi bubble but if tousen wanted to make those attacks lethal he could of and there is nothing kenpachi could of done at that point.... Read those please.

Now LATER on in the fight yes it was over cause he was used to the attack.. but those first 2 slashes could of been a nice shunpo let me cut you in half horizontally attacks and kenpachi could not of countered .

[Righteous Judgment]

Originally Posted by IppoSama

Bleach 146 page 13 | One Manga
Bleach 146 page 14 | One Manga
Bleach 146 page 15 | One Manga

im sorry to burst your kenpachi bubble but if tousen wanted to make those attacks lethal he could of and there is nothing kenpachi could of done at that point.... Read those please.

Now LATER on in the fight yes it was over cause he was used to the attack.. but those first 2 slashes could of been a nice shunpo let me cut you in half horizontally attacks and kenpachi could not of countered .

Or a nice let me take your head clean off and keep it as a trophy before I go to HM.

It's too bad that no one get to fight ken at their tactical and technical best. They are all brought down to ken's level where he can beat them thx to experience. Seriously how many advanced techniques did Noitora use? Just one friggin cero (we have seen much more from a guy who is supposedly weaker) after that it was all melee weaponry which is Ken's domain.

[KillMe]

many people have tried to cut kenpachi - none of them no matter how hard they have hit him ever put a fatal wound on him - closest was ichigo - who with every drop of reiatsu he had and them some extra borrowed from zangetsu couldn't chop kenpachi in half - if zangetsu couldn't cut kenpachi in half - sorry but no attack tousen has ever could

face it tousen simply didn't have the reiatsu nessesary to kill kenpachi

and your forgetting that kenpachi let tousen have his shot at killing him with one blow - no evasions nothing like that - guess what happened - kenpachi was not even bothered took a blow that tousen has aimed at his vitals and nothing - if tousen had gone for a killing blow from the start it simply would have played out exactly the same - tousen stabs kenpachi - kenpachi smiles grabs him and chops him in half

i find it really ammusing how people can honestly think that tousen could beat kenpachi when its clearly shown that kenpachi is faster - stronger and frankly smarter and its also shown in the manga with his virutally killing tousen - sorry but its canon kenpachi owned tousen hard

[IppoSama]

Originally Posted by KillMe

many people have tried to cut kenpachi - none of them no matter how hard they have hit him ever put a fatal wound on him - closest was ichigo - who with every drop of reiatsu he had and them some extra borrowed from zangetsu couldn't chop kenpachi in half - if zangetsu couldn't cut kenpachi in half - sorry but no attack tousen has ever could

face it tousen simply didn't have the reiatsu nessesary to kill kenpachi

and your forgetting that kenpachi let tousen have his shot at killing him with one blow - no evasions nothing like that - guess what happened - kenpachi was not even bothered took a blow that tousen has aimed at his vitals and nothing - if tousen had gone for a killing blow from the start it simply would have played out exactly the same - tousen stabs kenpachi - kenpachi smiles grabs him and chops him in half

i find it really ammusing how people can honestly think that tousen could beat kenpachi when its clearly shown that kenpachi is faster - stronger and frankly smarter and its also shown in the manga with his virutally killing tousen - sorry but its canon kenpachi owned tousen hard

believe what you will and ill do the same, its obvious how much you like kenpachi

[Righteous Judgment]

Originally Posted by KillMe

many people have tried to cut kenpachi - none of them no matter how hard they have hit him ever put a fatal wound on him - closest was ichigo - who with every drop of reiatsu he had and them some extra borrowed from zangetsu couldn't chop kenpachi in half - if zangetsu couldn't cut kenpachi in half - sorry but no attack tousen has ever could

No good guy has ever been fatally wounded so what you bring up is a moot point

face it tousen simply didn't have the reiatsu nessesary to kill kenpachi
and your forgetting that kenpachi let tousen have his shot at killing him with one blow - no evasions nothing like that - guess what happened - kenpachi was not even bothered took a blow that tousen has aimed at his vitals and nothing - if tousen had gone for a killing blow from the start it simply would have played out exactly the same - tousen stabs kenpachi - kenpachi smiles grabs him and chops him in half

Are you some how implying that kenpachi has so much reiatsu that if tousen had tried to cut off Ken's head he would have failed?

i find it really ammusing how people can honestly think that tousen could beat kenpachi when its clearly shown that kenpachi is faster - stronger and frankly smarter and its also shown in the manga with his virutally killing tousen - sorry but its canon kenpachi owned tousen hard

I find your opinions of ken to be amusing but only mildly so

[Ycagel]

Originally Posted by KillMe

many people have tried to cut kenpachi - none of them no matter how hard they have hit him ever put a fatal wound on him - closest was ichigo - who with every drop of reiatsu he had and them some extra borrowed from zangetsu couldn't chop kenpachi in half - if zangetsu couldn't cut kenpachi in half - sorry but no attack tousen has ever could

face it tousen simply didn't have the reiatsu nessesary to kill kenpachi

and your forgetting that kenpachi let tousen have his shot at killing him with one blow - no evasions nothing like that - guess what happened - kenpachi was not even bothered took a blow that tousen has aimed at his vitals and nothing - if tousen had gone for a killing blow from the start it simply would have played out exactly the same - tousen stabs kenpachi - kenpachi smiles grabs him and chops him in half

i find it really ammusing how people can honestly think that tousen could beat kenpachi when its clearly shown that kenpachi is faster - stronger and frankly smarter and its also shown in the manga with his virutally killing tousen - sorry but its canon kenpachi owned tousen hard

It's almost funny that it's so easy to prove you wrong... Tousen was able to stab his sword through Kenpachi's body in the battle, proving that he can...well, cut through him. In other words, yes, he would have won if he didn't rant about justice and went for the head or any other fatal point at first.

It's all pretty simple. At the start of their match, Tousen had the advantage with his hax Bankai and could have won if it wasn't for his rant. Later on, however, Kenpachi adapted to the Bankai and overcame it.

[wakakin]

Originally Posted by IppoSama

Bleach 146 page 13 | One Manga
Bleach 146 page 14 | One Manga
Bleach 146 page 15 | One Manga

im sorry to burst your kenpachi bubble but if tousen wanted to make those attacks lethal he could of and there is nothing kenpachi could of done at that point.... Read those please.

Now LATER on in the fight yes it was over cause he was used to the attack.. but those first 2 slashes could of been a nice shunpo let me cut you in half horizontally attacks and kenpachi could not of countered .

Going by the same logic..... couldn't Kenpachi, if he really wanted to kill the 2 captains quickly, took off his eye patch, then slice them both in half? Anyway, its rare in bleach that people go for a quick kill.

[IppoSama]

thats true but if were really going to play it like that , both captains would of bankaied while they were "hiding like rats" as he said ? But the thing that was in question that killme said was "impossible" was tousen finishing him off inside his bankai by those first two strikes which i think he could of.

[Righteous Judgment]

Originally Posted by wakakin

Going by the same logic..... couldn't Kenpachi, if he really wanted to kill the 2 captains quickly, took off his eye patch, then slice them both in half? Anyway, its rare in bleach that people go for a quick kill.

As slow as ken is? it's unlikely he would be able to pull off such a power slash on a character who could just shunpo away

[KillMe]

well norally i would go 12 rounds and then some but i've got fed up with such things in teh apst and now shall jsut say - yes i dont think tousen could ahve killed kenpachi no matter what he tried - he jsut didn't have the power to suffiently wound kenpachi - none not one of his hits did kenpachi any damage and taht was while kenpachi was fighting with his bells on ( handy since tousen is blind already ) his eyepatch firmly and place and only using 1 hand - tahts what it comes down to for me

and tousen is really irrelevant to the topic - since

hitsugaya < luppi < gr