Kakashi vs Sasuke [spoilers]

[mangekyosasuke]

without gates definately no if kakshi had the gates than its a definate yes but theres a change in ur body when u unlock gates and it takes a toll kakashi showed neither of those

[m c drew]

everyone seem to forget that sasuke have trained with oro for 3 years of couse oro would teach as many jutsus as possible to his dream body be serious. and yea kakashi is kage lv but i remember the 5th saying his speed is so great its almost as if he is taking drugs to do what he does. and if sasuke learned all the jutsus oro tried to teach him then he is obviously gonna know at least a thousand just as kakashi does and he can as well as kakashi simultainuly change jutsu but speed plays a big rule in naruto

[Chinari]

It doesnt really make sense to me why Oro taught Sasuke anything at all. He should have just knocked him out and put him in prison until time to take over his body. Maybe it was to make sure Sasuke's chakra stamina continued to grow or his Sharingan continued to get better or something. But it seems to me he should have just let him be weak so he didnt get messed up by Sasuke himself, then just take the body and you already know all those Jutsu anyway.

[GiantMidget]

Originally Posted by m c drew

everyone seem to forget that sasuke have trained with oro for 3 years of couse oro would teach as many jutsus as possible to his dream body be serious. and yea kakashi is kage lv but i remember the 5th saying his speed is so great its almost as if he is taking drugs to do what he does. and if sasuke learned all the jutsus oro tried to teach him then he is obviously gonna know at least a thousand just as kakashi does and he can as well as kakashi simultainuly change jutsu but speed plays a big rule in naruto

Just because he taught him jutsus doesnt mean he mastered it, o yea, he really used those thousand jutsus on orochimaru or DD right?
Speed is not factor agaisnt kakashi because he has the hax sharingan too, and ontop of that he has the MS which Sasuke doesnt have, kakashi also has gates, taijutsu as good as gai, genius intellect the level of shikamaru.

[ifeanyi84]

there is no way that sasuke knows as many jutsu as kakashi does. i dont even see why you would think that that was a worthwhile point to argue. even if orochimaru knows as many or more jutsu as kakashi, there's not even a reason for him to even attempt to teach them all to sasuke. in addition to his sharingan, kakashi is also very fast. speed wont be a factor in a fight between sasuke and kakashi.

i think that kakashi would take this fight though. sasuke recent improvements are still not enough to make up for kakashi's skill advantage and greater experience.

[mangekyosasuke]

kakashi doesn't have the gates if he had gates he would have went through a transformation of some sort and he wouldn't use the gates on something as stupid as rock climbing exp is not an issue anymore because every1 has been through enough battles jutsus don't matter unless their strong or can capture people and speed always matters they both have the sharingan and sasukes is way more developed so kakashi won't be able to do anything to sasuke with his mangekyo because sasuke is too fast

[ifeanyi84]

Originally Posted by mangekyosasuke

kakashi doesn't have the gates if he had gates he would have went through a transformation of some sort and he wouldn't use the gates on something as stupid as rock climbing exp is not an issue anymore because every1 has been through enough battles jutsus don't matter unless their strong or can capture people and speed always matters they both have the sharingan and sasukes is way more developed so kakashi won't be able to do anything to sasuke with his mangekyo because sasuke is too fast

i think that every single statement you just made in this post is wrong. there is no reason why kakashi would have to go through a transformation to release the gates. if you look back to the chunnin exam, when lee released the first gate, he didnt transform.

if you think experience doesnt matter, you must not have been following the manga very closely. experience is always a factor. if the power levels are close, and the experience is slanted to one side, the battle is probably also slanted to favor one side. in the kakuzu fight it is clearly stated that the fact that kakuzu had a lot more experience was an advantage for him.

to say that jutsus dont matter, is a pretty hard idea to fathom. in battles that sometimes play out like a game a chess, the jutsus are the moves that the ninja use to manuever into position for wins. they definitely matter a whole lot.

speed doesnt matter unless there is a speed gap. kudos to sasuke on increasing his speed, but in case you missed it, kakashi is very fast also. he's been that way the entire time that we've known his character.

and you cant say that sasuke's sharingan is way more developed than kakashi's. at best, sasuke's sharingan may have caught up. kakashi's is to the point where he developed the mangekyou sharingan. sasuke's isnt there yet. sasuke is an uchiha though, so his body is better suited to the sharingan though, which helps him out more in that department. we know that sasuke's sharingan is going to end up better. sasuke isnt there yet.


and please dont take as bashing your boy sasuke, cuz i'm just calling it like i see it. kakashi is nice. they didnt build him up to be a great ninja for no reason. i think kakashi would win if they fought now. that's probably gonna change in the near future, but i'll wait until then before i crown sasuke. if you wanna crown him, then crown him.

[mangekyosasuke]

alright yes lee did go through a transormation when he opened the gates and kakashi wouldn't open gates for something stupid like that if sasuke where to say release than would you think he has gates to??? thats what ur basing the gates theory off of kakashi saying release and than jumping.
i meant to say that the amount of jutsus one knows doesn't matter kakashi knows a million why does he only use like 5? because their the strong ones
exp doesn't matter very much anymore if it did than kazuku would have crushed naruto
+sasuke beat over 1000 ninja at once and akatsuki so he has exp
speed always matters the ability to do thing before your opponent always gives u an edge...
yes kakashi has the mangekyo but he would never be able to hit sasuke with it unless sasuke is sleeping
if kakashis is so more developed than why is his sharingan useless if he can't see the person? kakashi can't see chackra kakashi can only see whats going to happen next sasuke can do that and more this is probably because sasuke has 2 but 2 is greater than one so sasuke wins the sharingan battle if kakashi has gates than he wins but if he doesn't than he loses but honestly kakashi would use gates in time of need and he didn't use the gates on either of his akatsuki battles so i really don't think he has the gates

[GiantMidget]

Originally Posted by mangekyosasuke

alright yes lee did go through a transormation when he opened the gates and kakashi wouldn't open gates for something stupid like that if sasuke where to say release than would you think he has gates to??? thats what ur basing the gates theory off of kakashi saying release and than jumping.
i meant to say that the amount of jutsus one knows doesn't matter kakashi knows a million why does he only use like 5? because their the strong ones
exp doesn't matter very much anymore if it did than kazuku would have crushed naruto
+sasuke beat over 1000 ninja at once and akatsuki so he has exp
speed always matters the ability to do thing before your opponent always gives u an edge...
yes kakashi has the mangekyo but he would never be able to hit sasuke with it unless sasuke is sleeping
if kakashis is so more developed than why is his sharingan useless if he can't see the person? kakashi can't see chackra kakashi can only see whats going to happen next sasuke can do that and more this is probably because sasuke has 2 but 2 is greater than one so sasuke wins the sharingan battle if kakashi has gates than he wins but if he doesn't than he loses but honestly kakashi would use gates in time of need and he didn't use the gates on either of his akatsuki battles so i really don't think he has the gates

He wouldnt open his gates for something so stupid? im pretty sure he could have died, he he fell off that cliff, if he didnt use the gates to get to the top.
We're basing the theory off him saying release showing a picture of his brain, then having super human strength afterwards, the gates involve "releasing" the restraints the brain puts on your muscle so your done go over your limit til your muscles rip so its pretty clear Kakashi has gates, its not even a theory, its like crystal clear.

Exp doesnt matter to kakuzu cause it was like 6 on 1

Sasuke beat like a thousand ninjas big, deal, for all we know they are those avg shitty ninjas we see that only throw knives and stars or i like to call "iruka ninjas"

Speed is not a factor in this fight because Sasuke's opponent also posses the shariangan, so therefore they can actually track his movement unlike everyone else he fought who doesn't have the sharingan and was like"OMFGWTF" when they see his speed.

Sasukes sharingan is more develped then Kakashis? thats funny..... thats why he doesnt have MS and kakashi does right? And since when do you need the sharingan to see chakra? Chakra is visible half the time. Im pretty sure the number of sharingans doesn't matter, kakashis is an MS so it evens out if not even more greater.

he didn't use his gates in that battle because he had to protect some useless chuunins, if he used gates and it failed, he would have not been able to protect the other 2 if shikamaru happen to fail to kill Hidan and Hidan came back another reason would be for story purposes, Kishi wanted naruto to come and beat him thus not making Kakashi use gates.

[ifeanyi84]

Originally Posted by mangekyosasuke

alright yes lee did go through a transormation when he opened the gates and kakashi wouldn't open gates for something stupid like that if sasuke where to say release than would you think he has gates to??? thats what ur basing the gates theory off of kakashi saying release and than jumping.
i meant to say that the amount of jutsus one knows doesn't matter kakashi knows a million why does he only use like 5? because their the strong ones
exp doesn't matter very much anymore if it did than kazuku would have crushed naruto
+sasuke beat over 1000 ninja at once and akatsuki so he has exp
speed always matters the ability to do thing before your opponent always gives u an edge...
yes kakashi has the mangekyo but he would never be able to hit sasuke with it unless sasuke is sleeping
if kakashis is so more developed than why is his sharingan useless if he can't see the person? kakashi can't see chackra kakashi can only see whats going to happen next sasuke can do that and more this is probably because sasuke has 2 but 2 is greater than one so sasuke wins the sharingan battle if kakashi has gates than he wins but if he doesn't than he loses but honestly kakashi would use gates in time of need and he didn't use the gates on either of his akatsuki battles so i really don't think he has the gates

i told you that you dont know what you're talking about and you're still fronting like you do. i said lee didnt transform after he released the first gate, so there's no reason why kakashi would.
Naruto Manga Returns
that's a picture of lee after he releases the second gate. there was no transformation whatsoever.

kakashi uses certain jutsu to fit certain situations and also because certain jutsu fit his fighting style better.


experience matters. if i hear a character like kakuzu say to kakashi that the experience matters, then i think i'm gonna place more stock in that then in you trying to tell me on a forum that experience doesnt matter. kakashi has been a jounin for sasuke's whole life. there's no way that sasuke's little simulated battles with low class shinobi have provided him with enough experience to come close to kakashi's.

it seems like you dont understand my point about speed. it doesnt matter because sasuke most likely isnt faster than kakashi. if he is faster, it isnt by much. when you add to that, that they both have the sharingan, speed will not be a factor in this fight.

you dont know what kakashi's sharingan can and cant see. kakashi said that his sharingan cant see the chakra coils system or the tenketsu, but other than that i dont remember anything about him saying that he can see chakra. if anything, i would think that kakashi would be able to see chakra easily, because when obito first activated his sharingan, he was able to see that rin's chakra was irregular.

if you're gonna try to argue a point, it'd probably be a good idea to know at least a little about what you're talking about. you dont have to be an expert, but it's probably better that you're not completely wrong on all your statements when you post.

[mangekyosasuke]

oh if kakashi could see chacra than how come he couldn't see zabuza in the mist? he should have been able to see zabuza also kazukus battle wasn't 6 on 1 it was 1 on 1 and he knew it... that wasn't the first gate that was a totally different move Naruto Manga Returns
read the very next page let me point out the he "will" open them part so what kakashi has the mangekyo he would never be able to use it...sasuke can manipulate the kakashi can't do that and if both people can see their opponents next move they can both adjust to it if they can both adjust and sasuke can adjust b4 kakashi than sasuke has the adv. Naruto Manga Returns
Experience doesn't matter past a point if each opponent has enough experience about the other from raising one and watching eachother fight than their in for some trouble..... kabuto has been preaching about hows hes equal strength with kakashi yet even after sasuke killed oro kabuto didn't pull a move on sasuke y not? sasuke is stronger.
sasuke is uchiha blood and itachi said that makes the sharingan stronger he can use it longer i don't think kakashi can cast genjutsus with it either Naruto Manga Returns
oh and kakashis mangekyo is useless

[ifeanyi84]

Originally Posted by mangekyosasuke

oh if kakashi could see chacra than how come he couldn't see zabuza in the mist? he should have been able to see zabuza also kazukus battle wasn't 6 on 1 it was 1 on 1 and he knew it... that wasn't the first gate that was a totally different move Naruto Manga Returns
read the very next page let me point out the he "will" open them part so what kakashi has the mangekyo he would never be able to use it...sasuke can manipulate the kakashi can't do that and if both people can see their opponents next move they can both adjust to it if they can both adjust and sasuke can adjust b4 kakashi than sasuke has the adv. Naruto Manga Returns
Experience doesn't matter past a point if each opponent has enough experience about the other from raising one and watching eachother fight than their in for some trouble..... kabuto has been preaching about hows hes equal strength with kakashi yet even after sasuke killed oro kabuto didn't pull a move on sasuke y not? sasuke is stronger.
sasuke is uchiha blood and itachi said that makes the sharingan stronger he can use it longer i don't think kakashi can cast genjutsus with it either Naruto Manga Returns
oh and kakashis mangekyo is useless

no. you're the one that needs to keep reading. if you had kept reading, and followed the conversation between gai and kakashi, gai says that he has already opened the heal gate and that it was responsible for his quick recovery. the heal gate is the second gate. i hate to keep saying it, but stop posting if you havent made any attempt to actually find out what you're talking about.

the next part of your post doesnt make sense becase you didnt read it before you posted it. i have no idea what you're saying. i'm not even sure why you posted a link to a page of itachi stabbing a water clone of kakashi.

experience matters. you can say whatever you want. experience matters regardless of what you're doing. experience is always an advantage. it might not be the end all be all, but experience is a definite advantage and kakashi has far more experience than sasuke. sasuke has improved, but his experience is nothing compared to kakashi's.

kabuto hasnt been preaching anything. orochimaru said kabuto is no stronger than kakashi. key phrase no stronger than. and we have no idea why kabuto did nothing to him. unlike you, i'm not gonna pretend that i know why. my interpretation was that he was shocked that he wasnt sure he had made it out of the confrontation and was just shocked that sasuke was the one he overcame orochimaru. kabuto is not scared of sasuke though, we know that.

probably kakashi couldnt see in the mist is because the mist was so thick that there was no visibility. he cant see chakra if he cant see. that's like asking why he cant see chakra through his headband that covers his eye. the sharingan is not the byakugan. i'm puttin it out there just in case you're confused.

last but not least, i'll repeat one thing. since you dont know what you're talking about, stop posting in this section. sasuke and itachi are uchiha true, but the only thing different that we've seen from kakashi is that the sharingan places more strain on his body draining his chakra more. kakashi can definitely cast genjutsu. he did it in his first real battle of the manga when he faced zabuza for the first time.

[mangekyosasuke]

the first gate increases ur speed not arm strength Naruto Manga Returns
also the clone pic was to show that speed matters and i'm not going to waste my time trying to find out where kabuto says hes as strong as kakashi he says it numerous times...also kakashi is scared of orochimaru sasuke attacked him without a second thought you may say yeah hes weak but kakashi crapped himself at the sight of orochimaru and thatas that

[GiantMidget]

Originally Posted by mangekyosasuke

oh if kakashi could see chacra than how come he couldn't see zabuza in the mist? he should have been able to see zabuza also kazukus battle wasn't 6 on 1 it was 1 on 1 and he knew it... that wasn't the first gate that was a totally different move Naruto Manga Returns
read the very next page let me point out the he "will" open them part so what kakashi has the mangekyo he would never be able to use it...sasuke can manipulate the kakashi can't do that and if both people can see their opponents next move they can both adjust to it if they can both adjust and sasuke can adjust b4 kakashi than sasuke has the adv. Naruto Manga Returns
Experience doesn't matter past a point if each opponent has enough experience about the other from raising one and watching eachother fight than their in for some trouble..... kabuto has been preaching about hows hes equal strength with kakashi yet even after sasuke killed oro kabuto didn't pull a move on sasuke y not? sasuke is stronger.
sasuke is uchiha blood and itachi said that makes the sharingan stronger he can use it longer i don't think kakashi can cast genjutsus with it either Naruto Manga Returns
oh and kakashis mangekyo is useless

because the sharingan aint the byakugan it can't see through things, thats why the mist fucked up itachis sharingan as well.

You better learn proper grammar cause half the time i don't know what the fuck you saying.

What makes you think sasukes sharingan is so much better, it might put more of a strain kakashi but it is in no way inferior.
bottom line is kakashi has MS sasuke doesnt, kakashi sharingan>sasuke sharigan, take sasukes dick outta your mouth and accept the fact that sasukes sharingan as of right now is inferior to kakashi's.

Experience is always a factor, just like how Sasukes lack of experience made him let his guard down agasint orochimaru thus getting himself paralzyed.

kakashi has always been able to cast genjutsus with his sharingan on multiple occasions.

The MS is not useless, the black holes can easily fuck up sasukes movements a lot if not severing an arm or 2.

Originally Posted by mangekyosasuke

the first gate increases ur speed not arm strength Naruto Manga Returns
also the clone pic was to show that speed matters and i'm not going to waste my time trying to find out where kabuto says hes as strong as kakashi he says it numerous times...also kakashi is scared of orochimaru sasuke attacked him without a second thought you may say yeah hes weak but kakashi crapped himself at the sight of orochimaru and thatas that

In terms of taijutsu maybe kakashi only assume he was since he took out a couple of anbu he never really fought him, but in terms of everything else? no, can you seriously say Kabuto who only has above avg taijutsu some healing abilities can seriously beat kakashi who has the MS, taijutsu on level of gai, iteligence on th level of shikamaru, 1000 justsus, and gates?

omg still with the bs, Sasuke waited for orochimaru to be at his weakest when his body starts to fail and lying in his death bed to attack, him, yea thats so fucking impressive kakashi attempted to fight a full power orochimaru, your sasuke fanboyism is over 9000!

[ifeanyi84]

Originally Posted by mangekyosasuke

the first gate increases ur speed not arm strength Naruto Manga Returns
also the clone pic was to show that speed matters and i'm not going to waste my time trying to find out where kabuto says hes as strong as kakashi he says it numerous times...also kakashi is scared of orochimaru sasuke attacked him without a second thought you may say yeah hes weak but kakashi crapped himself at the sight of orochimaru and thatas that

are you even listening to anything i'm trying to tell you? first of all, if you're gonna post a link to something, make sure you read it, and that the link supports your position. there is nothing in that says the first gate only adds to your speed. the jutsu that he uses, because of the it is executed, makes you smash your opponent down into the ground at a high speed. the clone pic showed nothing other than the fact that despite the fact that kakashi was surprised by itachi's seal speed, he was still able to follow along and see what was happening. bringing it back into the context of sasuke and kakashi, there isnt a speed difference there that will actually matter or impact the fight. so speed will not matter in this fight. i dont know if you just aren't listening or dont understand, but i've been saying the same thing the whole time. sasuke fought orochimaru when he did because he knew fully well that orochimaru was ailing and that it was advantageous to strike. in kakashi's case, he definitely didnt crap himself. you forced it, and that's that. kakashi didnt hesitate to stand up to orochimaru, despite the fact that he acknowledged afterward that he was outclassed. if you would take off you're sasuke colored glasses for a second and stop being such a blatant nuthugger, then maybe we can actually have a real conversation. right now, your arguments are pretty useless, and they aint goin anywhere.

edit:

Originally Posted by GiantMidget

your sasuke fanboyism is over 9000!

funniest line of the thread so far.

[mangekyosasuke]

Originally Posted by ifeanyi84

are you even listening to anything i'm trying to tell you? first of all, if you're gonna post a link to something, make sure you read it, and that the link supports your position. there is nothing in that says the first gate only adds to your speed. the jutsu that he uses, because of the it is executed, makes you smash your opponent down into the ground at a high speed. the clone pic showed nothing other than the fact that despite the fact that kakashi was surprised by itachi's seal speed, he was still able to follow along and see what was happening. bringing it back into the context of sasuke and kakashi, there isnt a speed difference there that will actually matter or impact the fight. so speed will not matter in this fight. i dont know if you just aren't listening or dont understand, but i've been saying the same thing the whole time. sasuke fought orochimaru when he did because he knew fully well that orochimaru was ailing and that it was advantageous to strike. in kakashi's case, he definitely didnt crap himself. you forced it, and that's that. kakashi didnt hesitate to stand up to orochimaru, despite the fact that he acknowledged afterward that he was outclassed. if you would take off you're sasuke colored glasses for a second and stop being such a blatant nuthugger, then maybe we can actually have a real conversation. right now, your arguments are pretty useless, and they aint goin anywhere.

edit: funniest line of the thread so far.

first of all this isn't going anywhere because u guys all suck on kakashi and won't take him off his throne. u guys think sasuke is as bad as neji so that how badly u underestimate him....kakashi missed a barely moving dd yes he hit his arm but he was going for the kill...so i seriously doubt that he could hit sasuke when sasuke scared dd when it came to speed...alright this battle would last long and the longer kakashi uses the sharingan the more he gets worn out....sasukes speed is definately close to itachis or itachi wouldn't challenge him so kakashis sharingan will be worn out...also the mangekyo doesn't work against uchihas said by itachi and last but not leastsasuke trained under oro than slaughted him in his bed and awaited the transfer jutsu he didn't get caught if u didn't notice he kept his sharingan out so he could steal from oro and reverse the transfer. now he has a shitload of oros powers kakashi loses this

[ifeanyi84]

Originally Posted by mangekyosasuke

first of all this isn't going anywhere because u guys all suck on kakashi and won't take him off his throne. u guys think sasuke is as bad as neji so that how badly u underestimate him....kakashi missed a barely moving dd yes he hit his arm but he was going for the kill...so i seriously doubt that he could hit sasuke when sasuke scared dd when it came to speed...alright this battle would last long and the longer kakashi uses the sharingan the more he gets worn out....sasukes speed is definately close to itachis or itachi wouldn't challenge him so kakashis sharingan will be worn out...also the mangekyo doesn't work against uchihas said by itachi and last but not leastsasuke trained under oro than slaughted him in his bed and awaited the transfer jutsu he didn't get caught if u didn't notice he kept his sharingan out so he could steal from oro and reverse the transfer. now he has a shitload of oros powers kakashi loses this

i'm starting to think that you're just not that smart. deidara was on a bird flying away as fast as he could. how was he barely moving? deidara wasnt scared of sasuke's speed. he was surprised by it, and adjusted his attack accordingly. kakashi's ms works on anybody or anything. itachi said only an uchiha could stand against his tsukyomi genjutsu, he didnt say uchiha were immune to the ms. he didnt even slaughter orochimaru and orochimaru was basically dying in bed. orochimaru let himself get up to release poison's and paralyse sasuke. if he has a shitload of orochimaru's powers, please tell me what these new powers are, other than the regenerative ability.

do you even read the same manga as everyone else? i'm guessing you dont even read naruto. you've probably been reading some alternate version called sasuke.

and for you to think that neji is weak, your credibility is definitely shot to death.

[Puul]

Ifeanyi and midget, you're arguing with a 10 year old. Nothing he's said has made any sense aside from Sasuke and Itachi being Uchihas. Just stop responding, he's clearly not taking in anything that you're typing.

[mangekyosasuke]

Originally Posted by ifeanyi84

i'm starting to think that you're just not that smart. deidara was on a bird flying away as fast as he could. how was he barely moving? deidara wasnt scared of sasuke's speed. he was surprised by it, and adjusted his attack accordingly. kakashi's ms works on anybody or anything. itachi said only an uchiha could stand against his tsukyomi genjutsu, he didnt say uchiha were immune to the ms. he didnt even slaughter orochimaru and orochimaru was basically dying in bed. orochimaru let himself get up to release poison's and paralyse sasuke. if he has a shitload of orochimaru's powers, please tell me what these new powers are, other than the regenerative ability.

do you even read the same manga as everyone else? i'm guessing you dont even read naruto. you've probably been reading some alternate version called sasuke.

and for you to think that neji is weak, your credibility is definitely shot to death.

bold1) where does it say dd was flying as fast as he could?
Bold 2) Naruto Manga Returns
bold 3)Naruto Manga Returns pay attention to the part where he says as long as one has the sharingan they can put up resistance to the mangekyo than he says the move he was about to use was different
bold 4) pay attention to the (s) Naruto Manga Returns

[ifeanyi84]

Originally Posted by mangekyosasuke

bold1) where does it say dd was flying as fast as he could?
Bold 2) Naruto Manga Returns
bold 3)Naruto Manga Returns pay attention to the part where he says as long as one has the sharingan they can put up resistance to the mangekyo than he says the move he was about to use was different
bold 4) pay attention to the (s) Naruto Manga Returns

what do you mean where does it say he was flying as fast as he could? he was trying to get away, what else would he be doing? i dont understand why you posted any of those links? were just trying to discredit yourself? those links support what i was trying to tell you.

edit:

Originally Posted by Puul

Ifeanyi and midget, you're arguing with a 10 year old. Nothing he's said has made any sense aside from Sasuke and Itachi being Uchihas. Just stop responding, he's clearly not taking in anything that you're typing.

i didnt realize i was arguing with a 10 year old, but now it all makes sense.