Kakashi vs Sasuke [spoilers]

[Uchihaeyez]

Originally Posted by hi its me

I'm a bit late on this but how do you know if thats the only MS technique Kakashi knows? I mean he was fighting Deidara a fair distance. I doubt Deidara would look in to Kakashi's eyes from that distance anyway..

I doubt he does, but to anwser your question we don't.

And neither does anyone else, so don't try to make that a point as to him beating sasuke.

[slyfox87]

one time i am gonna stand of for sasuke, kakashi said himself that naruto is stronger than him, and i dont think naruto is stronger than sasuke they are probably around the same level, so it only makes sense that both naruto and sasuke have gotten stronger than kakashi

[itachi_red_14]

i think sasuke would win cuz when kakashi uses the sharingan he gets more tired easily
and sasuke doesnt

[GiantMidget]

Originally Posted by slyfox87

one time i am gonna stand of for sasuke, kakashi said himself that naruto is stronger than him, and i dont think naruto is stronger than sasuke they are probably around the same level, so it only makes sense that both naruto and sasuke have gotten stronger than kakashi

Naruto is not more powerful then kakashi as an overall fighter, he merely got the rasenshuriken which he couldn't do himself. naruto surpassed kakashi in 1 aspect, that does not mean naruto>kakashi as an overall fighter.

[Uchihaeyez]

Originally Posted by GiantMidget

Naruto is not more powerful then kakashi as an overall fighter, he merely got the rasenshuriken which he couldn't do himself. naruto surpassed kakashi in 1 aspect, that does not mean naruto>kakashi as an overall fighter.

Especially since narutos fighting style is slow hand to hand combat with himself and shadow clones, and since sharingan tracks movement i'd say that kaakshi is his worst match. He's just lucky kakashi doesnt know, or at least hasnt been shown to administer high level sharingan genjutsu.

GM hit it right on the nose, he only surpassed him in that one category.

[ifeanyi84]

kakashi definitely is adept at using and dispelling genjutsu with and without his sharingan. he's been doing it since we've known him.

[Uchihaeyez]

Originally Posted by ifeanyi84

kakashi definitely is adept at using and dispelling genjutsu with and without his sharingan. he's been doing it since we've known him.

Genjutsu?
Against zabuza, and sakura, but i dont remember anyting besides that?

[ifeanyi84]

i think we can say that he's pretty adept at it. he mastered the sharingan eye and when we met kakashi he was doing genjutsu. on top of that, against itachi in konoha, when he saw itachi about to use a new doujutsu, which he knew would most likely be genjutsu, he told kurenai and asuma to shut their eyes while he was looking directly at itachi, seemingly confident that he could deal with whatever itachi had to dish out. because of all that, i think it's safe to say kakashi is adept with genjutsu.

[mangekyosasuke]

hahaha kakashi didn't think he could handle itach he thought his sharingan could stand up to the mangekyo which was obviously a joke. alright lets look at what we have here # of jutsus doesn't matter because each can copy the others jutsu. now we have manipulation of jutsus give that to sasuke because he seems to do what ever he wants with lightning and fire. stamana this would be a sharingan battle and since sasuke is not effected by his sharingan he gets that too. now we have tiajutsu they both seem to have mastered hand to hand so than we go to speed kakashi couldn't follow itachis hand signals and he could barely dodge itachis attacks. sasuke on the other hand got kicked in the face and spike into the ground but it turned out to be a clone than he took care of itachi and out smarted/manouuvered (whichever way u want to put it) him. while this probably is a clone he still did it and in when kakashi was faced with the clone he had the same result he stabbed itachi in the back. so speed is about equal sasuke has better vision though. now we go to experience or battle knowledge sasuke points out that he knows the correct way to deal with tiajutsu (when he was block by sai and stabbed yamato) and ninjutsu (when he fought dd). kakashi has been shown to know both also. sasuke is stubborn but has a back up plan always and kakashi is open minded he tries new things. both can hurt you in the long run. now we look at long range kakashi has his mangekyo sasuke has nothin (has been stated by sasuke and dd). so kakashi has long range over sasuke. lets face it though this battle is going to be close quarters.lets look at genjutsu sasuke has been seen to display genjutsu alot and kakashi not so much (don't think its his style) but probably dispell it easily but i don't think genjutsu is going to come into play. both have summons in their arsenal sasuke has a giant snake and a shitload of little snakes while kakashi has dogs fror trapping his pray. the dogs will be inaffective against sasuke due to his chidori nagashi. which can also be used to paralyze kakashi. kakshi is a better fighter while amoungst a group because he uses teamwork and has settled down as a sensei while sasuke refuses to have bonds with anybody. lets look at boosts now kakashi has the gates and sasuke has his cs2 its unknown how many gates kakashi has but he atleast has 1-3 but sasuke has what i would call an ultimate defence against tiajutsu he could heavily discharge his chidori nagashi while kakashi is in the gates this would prevent kakashi from hurting him but take a major chakra toll on sasuke. kakashi would have about the same toll from his gates. this battle is a close match but kakashis sharingan would hurt him in the long run b/c i think he would lose his stamana b4 sasuke and thats my input.

[artisabang94]

i favor kakshi over sasuke and all but really sasuke would most likely kill kakshi mostly do to the fact tht even naruto at this ponit could kill kakshi and seeing as kakshi doesn't have sasuke's speed advansed(sp) mastery of the chdori and tht sasuke killed orhcimaru even if u was weakned u was still a sain and tht counts for somethingso sasuke could most likely kill kakashi

[Girfinkle1]

so are u for sasuke or kakashi lol u said well i pick kakashi but sasuke seems stronger....
holly shit mangekyo try breaking up ur post but i agree with it

[Uchihaeyez]

Originally Posted by mangekyosasuke

hahaha kakashi didn't think he could handle itach he thought his sharingan could stand up to the mangekyo which was obviously a joke. alright lets look at what we have here # of jutsus doesn't matter because each can copy the others jutsu. now we have manipulation of jutsus give that to sasuke because he seems to do what ever he wants with lightning and fire. stamana this would be a sharingan battle and since sasuke is not effected by his sharingan he gets that too. now we have tiajutsu they both seem to have mastered hand to hand so than we go to speed kakashi couldn't follow itachis hand signals and he could barely dodge itachis attacks. sasuke on the other hand got kicked in the face and spike into the ground but it turned out to be a clone than he took care of itachi and out smarted/manouuvered (whichever way u want to put it) him. while this probably is a clone he still did it and in when kakashi was faced with the clone he had the same result he stabbed itachi in the back. so speed is about equal sasuke has better vision though. now we go to experience or battle knowledge sasuke points out that he knows the correct way to deal with tiajutsu (when he was block by sai and stabbed yamato) and ninjutsu (when he fought dd). kakashi has been shown to know both also. sasuke is stubborn but has a back up plan always and kakashi is open minded he tries new things. both can hurt you in the long run. now we look at long range kakashi has his mangekyo sasuke has nothin (has been stated by sasuke and dd). so kakashi has long range over sasuke. lets face it though this battle is going to be close quarters.lets look at genjutsu sasuke has been seen to display genjutsu alot and kakashi not so much (don't think its his style) but probably dispell it easily but i don't think genjutsu is going to come into play. both have summons in their arsenal sasuke has a giant snake and a shitload of little snakes while kakashi has dogs fror trapping his pray. the dogs will be inaffective against sasuke due to his chidori nagashi. which can also be used to paralyze kakashi. kakshi is a better fighter while amoungst a group because he uses teamwork and has settled down as a sensei while sasuke refuses to have bonds with anybody. lets look at boosts now kakashi has the gates and sasuke has his cs2 its unknown how many gates kakashi has but he atleast has 1-3 but sasuke has what i would call an ultimate defence against tiajutsu he could heavily discharge his chidori nagashi while kakashi is in the gates this would prevent kakashi from hurting him but take a major chakra toll on sasuke. kakashi would have about the same toll from his gates. this battle is a close match but kakashis sharingan would hurt him in the long run b/c i think he would lose his stamana b4 sasuke and thats my input.

Originally Posted by Girfinkle1

so are u for sasuke or kakashi lol u said well i pick kakashi but sasuke seems stronger....
holly shit mangekyo try breaking up ur post but i agree with it

You guys all seem to be forgetting the basis of Sasuke's newly formed fighting style.

He grounds his fighting style with genjutsu, and form manipulation of chidori.

Kakashi has the sharingan and can see through genjutsu, and his use of chidori was based of kakashi's teachings.

Kakashi is basically the foundations of sasuke's entire fighting ability, and you think he would defeat him with the same abilities kakashi's been using since he was like 8?

Sasuke's body flicker isn't really a factor since kakashi's sharingan would track his movement.

And theoretically kakashi could negate chidori nagashi with a chidori of his own, or even a rasengan.

[mangekyosasuke]

kakashi can't manipulate his chidori to kakashi the chidori is just a really strong kunia its like kakashi invented the knife and sasuke turned it into a sword shield and armor sasukes chidoris manhandle kakashis

[GiantMidget]

Originally Posted by mangekyosasuke

kakashi can't manipulate his chidori to kakashi the chidori is just a really strong kunia its like kakashi invented the knife and sasuke turned it into a sword shield and armor sasukes chidoris manhandle kakashis

kakashi's cut a lighting bolt with his Raikiri, the lack of shape manipulation is made up with power.

[Girfinkle1]

ur an idiot dude the strength of the chidori comes from the speed kakashi said it himself and whos to say sasuke wouldn't be able to cut a lightning bolt

[Uchihaeyez]

Originally Posted by mangekyosasuke

kakashi can't manipulate his chidori to kakashi the chidori is just a really strong kunia its like kakashi invented the knife and sasuke turned it into a sword shield and armor sasukes chidoris manhandle kakashis

Thats because that is one jutsu sasuke has backed his fighting style with. He's had to make different variations of it, since its a jutsu he spams all the time unlike kakashi, who has had a thousand jutsu at his disposal.

Originally Posted by Girfinkle1

ur an idiot dude the strength of the chidori comes from the speed kakashi said it himself and whos to say sasuke wouldn't be able to cut a lightning bolt

If thats the case then the statment about kakashi not being able to get past chidori nagashi is wrong. Since chidori nagashi is nothing more than a current, if sasuke tried to protect himself with chidori nagashi while kakashi ran at him full speed, then his chidori would pierce sasuke's and kill him. Not saying the battle would be ended that easilly, just proving that chidori nagashi isnt as fool proof as you think.

[Girfinkle1]

alright dude let me break out a little science for u keep in mind i don't know how old u are but if ur in 8th grade u'll learn this its called energy. theres alot of algebra in this one if point a is running 40 miles an hour at point b and hits point b than point be his giving off a 40mph amount of energy back a point a. or let me make it realistic if a car is driving at 40 mph and hits a tree the reason the car gets most of the damage is bc the tree returned the 40mph amount of energy back at the car. however if a car going 40 mph hits another car going 40mph the opposite way the crash is done at 80mph but if a car going 40mph hits another car going 39 mph the speed at which the crash happened was 1 mph. got it? so kakashis speed with his chidori is equivelent to sasukes chidori negashi.
1 more thing uchiha eyes sasuke trained with oro (the dude who looked for new jutsus everyday of his life) for 2.5 years i think sasuke knows a bunch of other jutsus not to mention sasuke has another thing called the sharingan and he can copy all of kakashis jutsus much like kakashi does to all of his opponents so thats why the # of jutsus kakashi knows is irrelevant

[Uchihaeyez]

Originally Posted by Girfinkle1

alright dude let me break out a little science for u keep in mind i don't know how old u are but if ur in 8th grade u'll learn this its called energy. theres alot of algebra in this one if point a is running 40 miles an hour at point b and hits point b than point be his giving off a 40mph amount of energy back a point a. or let me make it realistic if a car is driving at 40 mph and hits a tree the reason the car gets most of the damage is bc the tree returned the 40mph amount of energy back at the car. however if a car going 40 mph hits another car going 40mph the opposite way the crash is done at 80mph but if a car going 40mph hits another car going 39 mph the speed at which the crash happened was 1 mph. got it? so kakashis speed with his chidori is equivelent to sasukes chidori negashi.
1 more thing uchiha eyes sasuke trained with oro (the dude who looked for new jutsus everyday of his life) for 2.5 years i think sasuke knows a bunch of other jutsus not to mention sasuke has another thing called the sharingan and he can copy all of kakashis jutsus much like kakashi does to all of his opponents so thats why the # of jutsus kakashi knows is irrelevant

Wtf? Your whole analogy made no sense. How the hell would kakashi slamming his chidori into sasuke's return the same amount of attack power? Your not even listening to your own explanation from earlier. Sasuke's chidori is in a current, while kakashi's is in the bodies fastest attainable speed, the arm thrust.

There's no way in hell the power would be equivalent.

[ifeanyi84]

Originally Posted by mangekyosasuke

hahaha kakashi didn't think he could handle itach he thought his sharingan could stand up to the mangekyo which was obviously a joke. alright lets look at what we have here # of jutsus doesn't matter because each can copy the others jutsu. now we have manipulation of jutsus give that to sasuke because he seems to do what ever he wants with lightning and fire. stamana this would be a sharingan battle and since sasuke is not effected by his sharingan he gets that too. now we have tiajutsu they both seem to have mastered hand to hand so than we go to speed kakashi couldn't follow itachis hand signals and he could barely dodge itachis attacks. sasuke on the other hand got kicked in the face and spike into the ground but it turned out to be a clone than he took care of itachi and out smarted/manouuvered (whichever way u want to put it) him. while this probably is a clone he still did it and in when kakashi was faced with the clone he had the same result he stabbed itachi in the back. so speed is about equal sasuke has better vision though. now we go to experience or battle knowledge sasuke points out that he knows the correct way to deal with tiajutsu (when he was block by sai and stabbed yamato) and ninjutsu (when he fought dd). kakashi has been shown to know both also. sasuke is stubborn but has a back up plan always and kakashi is open minded he tries new things. both can hurt you in the long run. now we look at long range kakashi has his mangekyo sasuke has nothin (has been stated by sasuke and dd). so kakashi has long range over sasuke. lets face it though this battle is going to be close quarters.lets look at genjutsu sasuke has been seen to display genjutsu alot and kakashi not so much (don't think its his style) but probably dispell it easily but i don't think genjutsu is going to come into play. both have summons in their arsenal sasuke has a giant snake and a shitload of little snakes while kakashi has dogs fror trapping his pray. the dogs will be inaffective against sasuke due to his chidori nagashi. which can also be used to paralyze kakashi. kakshi is a better fighter while amoungst a group because he uses teamwork and has settled down as a sensei while sasuke refuses to have bonds with anybody. lets look at boosts now kakashi has the gates and sasuke has his cs2 its unknown how many gates kakashi has but he atleast has 1-3 but sasuke has what i would call an ultimate defence against tiajutsu he could heavily discharge his chidori nagashi while kakashi is in the gates this would prevent kakashi from hurting him but take a major chakra toll on sasuke. kakashi would have about the same toll from his gates. this battle is a close match but kakashis sharingan would hurt him in the long run b/c i think he would lose his stamana b4 sasuke and thats my input.

kakashi clearly thought he could deal with itachi's genjutsu. he didnt know about tsukyomi at the time and thus he lost. if you read and comprehended what i said, my point is simply that kakashi is adept with genjutsu. until itachi used tsukyomi, kakashi matched itachi and was able to protect asuma and kurenai at the same time.
you said that sasuke can do whatever he wants with lightning and fire and yet sasuke has not shown a fire jutsu since the time-skip. also, the fact remains that raikiri is a higher rank jutsu than sasuke's chidori.
there is no way to say that sasuke's taijutsu has suddenly improved from what it was. we know that kakashi was and is very skilled with taijutsu, but from sasuke we have not seen any examples that would illustrate his growth in that area. kakashi did more than barely dodge itachi's attacks. he was able to fight evenly with itachi while still looking out for kurenai. sasuke's speed with shuinshin may be about equal to kakashi's but i think that otherwise he falls short. you also said that sasuke's vision is better than kakashi's as if it's a fact when the manga has yet to show evidence of that.
i would also like to point out that you glossed over the part about battle experience or knowledge. in that area, kakashi is hands down, unequivocally better than sasuke. kakashi has been a jounin for a sasuke's entire life and has been called the leaf's #1 tactician. sasuke's little fight experience is even close to the war experience that kakashi has. not to mention that kakashi is as smart as or smarter than shikamaru(i cant remember which one of them was stated) and sasuke isnt even close in this arena. sasuke has more stamina than kakashi, but that's about the only thing that he has more of.
sasuke was like a lesser version of kakashi until he went to orochimaru. now he's better than he was, and has some things that differentiate him from a kakashi a little more, but he's still not gonna take out kakashi yet.

and can we please stop referrencing the sasuke/itachi fight until after the fight is actually over and the action can be appreciated in context for what it really is? i dont see the point of comparing sasuke and itachi off of their fight, when we dont even know what's really real and what's not.

[slyfox87]

what are u ppl talkiing about kakashi clearly said naruto ur stronger than me, stop changing what he said, i mean he knows what he can do better than anyone else so if he says naruto is stronger than him ill talk his words over us, ps this is just like how itachi said he couldnt beat jiraiya and all of u started saying that itachi didnt mean to say that and he could, i mean if the own person says they cant it means THEY CANT <